White River Township Fire Protection District

Board Meeting Minutes

April 3, 2007

 

District Board Members Present:

Rev. Jim Dodson

Butch Sutton

Jon Raker

 

White River Twp Fire Department Employees Present:

Chief Cassin

Chief Brown

Chief Slauter

Chief Engmark

Captain Hart

Lt. Scholl

Mike Combs

Dale Saucier

Richard Woehlecke

Jeff Campbell

Scott Alexander

Crystal Young

 

Others Present:

Tricia Leminger

Dan Sulkoske

                                                                                                                                

Note:  Motions are italicized and in blue.


 

 

Rev. Dodson called the meeting to order at 7:02 p.m.

 

                 

              I.      Approval of Minutes from February 6th Meeting

a.      Jon Raker motions that the minutes be approved.  Butch Sutton seconds.

b.      All in favor and motion carries.

            II.      Financial Update

a.      Chief Cassin stated that the bank balance is on pg. 13 of the meeting packet which also shows the balance per fund.

b.      Page 14 lists all funds.  Chief Cassin stated that he sent e-mails to board members showing each individual fund.

c.      Page 15 shows the 30000 categories.

                                                              i.      The Vehicle Maintenance category is over budget.  The department has had several catastrophic repairs on both the Ladder and the Rescue and will be going higher due to the failure of the Ladder this week.  It was towed twice costing approximately $1000 each time.  At this point the department is waiting on whether it will be a warranty fix.

                                                              i.      The Commercial Property category has no pattern on the billing; it is usually a timing thing.

                                                            ii.      The department has just received a large shipment of uniforms, the cost will even out.

d.      Mr. Sutton inquired as to why the department is over budget on FT wages.

                                                              i.      Chief Cassin stated that one of the reasons was the significant severance package paid out to Chief Tibbetts.  Another reason is the loss of Eric Wiseman, there has been a need for back fill and the department is attempting not to pay overtime but at times has needed to.  Most of the backfill has been with Part-time but there have been issues where we have needed the manpower and have filled the spots with firefighters who are available.

e.      Pg. 17 shows Capital Outlays under budget; most of the funds are reserved to the latter half of the year.

f.        Pg. 18 is a recap of the Station 51 project.

          III.      Old Business

a.      Station 51 Building Project Update

                                                              i.      At last months meeting the department received a delay notice stating there were redesign issues.

1.      Ms. Leminger then followed up with Senefeld and Kramer Corp and has attended the progress meeting and has clarified that there were not redesign issues but that there were coordination issues.

2.      Ms. Leminger also stated that the contractor is catching up on the work orders and getting back on track.

                                                            ii.      Mr. Sulkoske stated that the contractor is frustrated over several different issues such as weather, internal issues, the water tap fees and the county issues.  He handed out an updated project schedule showing the revised date as the end of June.

1.      Mr. Sulkoske stated that the contractor stated that there will be no extra cost associated with the delay brought on by the weather, the east side drainage and the utility water tap issues.

                                                          iii.      Mr. Sulkoske then handed out a drawing of the possible resolutions for the utility issue.

1.      There is an 8” main behind adjacent project to which Bargersville Utilities stated the project could tap into the 8” with a 4” and 2” instead of coming from the street.

2.      Mr. Sulkoske spoke to someone from Bargersville Utilities who acknowledged that this was something that fell through the cracks and there is not much that can be done about it now.  The contractor should have moved it at that time but there is nothing to do to enforce it now and nothing Senefeld could have foreseen.

a.      The approvals were going on at the same time and the other development should have moved the main.

3.      The change in the size from 6” to 4” & 2” will require a booster pump system since the building was set up to accept the 6”.

a.      Cost for the size of the line will be $24,000 to $25,000.  Total cost will be approximately $40,000.

b.      There will also be an additional cost for running the line and the extra electrical for the pump.

4.      There are three options:

a.      The 6” line is optimal, can get that by pulling from the original tap.

b.      Run the 4” & 2” lines from the adjoining development.

c.      Challenge Bargersville Utilities to tap into the development with a 6” line.

d.      Time is the enemy at this point because everything is waiting on the completion of the water tap.

5.      Mr. Dodson stated that the 6” was originally approved.  Bargersville Utilities approved the move of the main to the corner of the property.  Mr. Sulkoske stated that once the department went to pay the tap fee Bargersville Utilities had the opportunity to see what happened; they will no longer approve the tap permit until we move the tap even though Senefeld provided Bargersville Utilities with all the proper papers showing the approval.

6.      Mr. Sutton reiterated that Bargersville Utilities acknowledged somewhat that the problem was a result of something they did.  Bill Reynolds is the person Mr. Sulkoske has been in contact with.

7.      Mr. Dodson stated that we could authorize running the original plan then figure out how to pay, wait until next month after speaking to Bargersville Utilities, or go through the re-design for going from the 6” to the 4 & 2”.

a.      Mr. Dodson recommends moving the main then go after someone for the expense of the move.

b.      Mr. Sulkoske stated that the expense could run from 60-80 thousand dollars.  If that is the decision the board makes he would contact Senefeld and have them do the design and submit it to Bargersville.

c.      Ms. Leminger has spoken to Scott Senefeld, he is waiting for a reply from Bill Reynolds as to what needs to be done.  She also spoke to Mr. Sulkoske who believes we could get the 6” from the tap.

8.      Mr. Sutton wanted to be clear that there were three options:

a.      Move the main.

b.      Come off of the development with a 4” & 2”

c.      Come off of the development with a 6” (only if ok’d by Bargersville Utilities) Ms. Leminger, Mr. Sulkoske, and Mr. Senefeld will attempt to meet with Bargersville Utilities and explain to them the expense in adjusting to a situation in which was overlooked by them.

9.      Chief Brown stated that if they are allowing the tap they should allow for the 6”.

a.      They should not be able to restrict to a 4” & 2”.  The reason we could not go the other way is because you cannot run a 6” under a public road.  Since the tap to the east will not be under pavement Chief Brown believes a 6” could still be run from the tap.

b.      Mr. Sulkoske stated that Bill Reynolds told him they could not have the 6” off of the tap.  Chief Brown believes we should be able to if we could meet with them. 

c.      Mr. Sulkoske believes there is leverage since Bargersville Utilities has created the problem.

                                                           iv.      Mr. Raker asked if Mr. Dodson would like a motion to meet with Bargersville Utilities to try to get the 6” and if that cannot be accomplished then authorize Dr. Shufflebarger to okay the work to come from the original main on the street.

1.      Mr. Dodson believes we should wait until a meeting is set up with Mr. Reynolds next week then decide what we can do from there.

2.      Mr. Sutton asked if it is in the best interest of everyone to tap off of the 8” line then to come off of the main.

3.      Mr. Sulkoske stated that it would be in Bargersville’s best interest if they are going to have to pay to move it.  Chief Brown stated that if Bargersville is going to have to pay to move it they would go off of the 8” line.

4.      Mr. Sulkoske stated that the largest problem is time; we have two weeks time max to decide what to do.

5.      Mr. Raker believes we should take one more shot at getting the 6” off of the 8”.  At this point it is still cheaper to go with the 4” & 2” then moving the main from the street.  The cheapest option is to get the 6” off of the 8”.  Moving the main would be twice the cost.

                                                             v.      Mr. Raker starts to motion entertaining talks with Bargersville Utilities to get the 6” off of the 8” on the property to the East and if that is unsuccessful is there a need to motion for a second option at this time.

1.      Ms. Leminger believes the motion should be all encompassing.  One way would be to authorize the chairman to proceed with the 6” off of the 8” or the alternative 4” & 2” off of the 8”.

2.      Mr. Sulkoske thought at one time that it was desirable to go with the 6”.  Dr. Shufflebarger believes that we should get it resolved to get rid of the delays and that if we have to pay it we then need to determine were we will go to recoup the cost.

3.      Mr. Sutton asked if there was a specific technical reason why we would have to go with the 6”.  Chief Brown stated that the volume is needed to go through the fire suppression line.  The need for the pump system should fix that.  The next problem as stated by Chief Cassin is the physical size of the pump.  At this point the riser room has already been expanded once leaving barely enough room for the pump.

4.      Ms. Leminger suggests that we set up a meeting with Bargersville concerning the 6” off of the 8” get Chief Brown involved in the process.  Once a decision is made or more issues arise a special meeting could be set up to decide what step to be taken next.

                                                           vi.      Jon Raker motions to proceed with the 6” off of the 8” allowing time to meet with Bargersville Utilities then ratify action at the next board meeting.  Butch Sutton seconds.

                                                         vii.      All in favor and the motion carries.

                                                       viii.      Target date is now some time in mid-July or sooner.

b.      Fire Chief hiring process update

                                                              i.      Mr. Sutton believes that our job description is too restrictive.

1.      Mr. Dodson believes that it is the Job requirements and asked if we should lower the requirements to a Bachelor’s Degree or something equivalent.

2.      Dr. Shufflebarger told Mr. Dodson that he would like for them to move ahead but he is a little uneasy changing the minimum requirements with only three of the five in attendance.

                                                            ii.      Mr. Dodson asked Ms. Leminger to bring a timeline and she believes that the board is in no hurry since everything is going smoothly with the department.  She handed out two separate timelines stating the first is the one she recommends.

1.      First Mr. Dodson and Mr. Kite will meet with Ms. Leminger between now and April 20 to finalize the application, timeline, and what process is going to be used.  Also to hone in on the qualifications that are going to be used.

2.      By April 23 the department should have the final applications and packets together along with the finalized timeline for the process.  Final decisions on where to post the job (nation wide or local) should be made.  After all of this has been put together there will be a packet made up and handed to the full board on May 1 for everyone to approve.

3.      After the May 1 meeting everything should be a go.  Two weeks time is allowed following that meeting to do the advertising.  Depending on the amount of applications received there should be a final recommendation for the position during the August meeting.

4.      Her recommendation since Mr. Kite is not here and based on what Mr. Dodson has stated she believes the board should take a couple more weeks to work through a couple of issues.

                                                          iii.      Ms. Leminger handed out a second timeline to the board that would move the recommendation up to the July meeting which means the board would need to get the process started before the next board meeting.  She has drafts of the application packet for review.  Once reviewed the process can start.  She believes the process will be determined by the amount of applications received.  Also she assumes the search will stay local.

1.      During a hiring process for another department’s chief position they advertised locally and on web sites.  A couple out of state applications were received with the total amount received approximately 20.

                                                           iv.      Mr. Sutton believes the only differences in the timeline is either hurry up and finalize or spend time to review and finalize and start after the next board meeting. 

                                                             v.      Mr. Dodson is much more comfortable in going with the longer timeline and finalizing everything with everyone’s input.

                                                           vi.      Chief Slauter asked why the concern on being to restrictive on the Bachelor’s Degree.  Mr. Dodson responds that it isn’t the question of the Bachelor’s Degree but is there something that is equivalent.  In looking around many requirements are an either/or and many of the older chief do not have the degree.

1.      Chief Slauter stated that with his experience at the National Fire Academy, fire chief nationally are considered CEO’s of corporations now and he believes the more and better education you can have with a bachelor’s degree the better off the department will be.

2.      Chief Brown stated that we have a $5 million dollar company here.  To which Mr. Dodson stated that we aren’t going go find any argument here concerning education.

3.      Chief Slauter brings up the fact that the only thing equivalent would be the EFO program (to which he believes Mr. Raker can back him up) and he is currently in the program and believes it is no where near a bachelors program.

4.      Mr. Raker is not sure if Mr. Dodson’s meaning is in degree equivalency or experience or maybe a little of both.

5.      Mr. Sutton believes that the question is should that be the minimum.  Do we loose a good person by making that the minimum requirement?

                                                         vii.      Mr. Alexander spoke up with concerns as a resident of the district that the board is dragging the process out until August since the process started in January.  He believes Dr. Shufflebarger gave pretty clear instructions in January that a committee was to be formed and come back to the next meeting with firm recommendations.  It is now three months later and he is not sure we are any closer to starting the process than we were in January.

1.      He has taken part in executive level hiring and does not understand why this is taking eight months.  As a taxpayer this makes no sense to him.

                                                       viii.      Ms. Leminger stated that the timeline could fluctuate.  The advertising time could be cut down, finalization could be done a little quicker and depending on the amount of applications it may not take a couple of months.

                                                           ix.      Mr. Raker does not believe we should adopt the entire timeline this evening but recommend getting the committee together and for the next meeting bring in the final process.  Mr. Dodson believes if Dr. Shufflebarger were in attendance tonight they would be able to pin down the requirements but at this point he is uncomfortable in making that decision. 

1.      Mr. Sutton concurs with Mr. Raker that the timeline is not exactly what we want but there isn’t anything to approve at this time.

2.      Mr. Dodson will get the committee together and finalize the recommendation within the next two weeks.  He will contact the other board members through e-mail.

3.      Mr. Sutton believes the timeline is saying once everything is approved there is a month to advertise and get the packet out and two months for the hiring.  Mr. Dodson believes the process could go quicker.

4.      Mr. Dodson stated that the item will be tabled and finished up next month.

         IV.      New Business

a.      Full-time engineer opening

                                                              i.      Chief Cassin informed the board that Eric Wiseman has left the department for a full-time position with IFD.

1.      March 24 was his last day.

2.      There is one name left on the list.  Richard Woehlecke has been with the department in a part-time roll for the last two years.  His dad was a volunteer on the department many years ago.

3.      Mr. Dodson asked Firefighter Woehlecke if he was in the cadet program to which he replied yes.

                                                            ii.      Chief Cassin is asking to have him brought up.

                                                          iii.      Butch Sutton motions to accept Chief Cassin’s recommendation.  Jon Raker seconds.

                                                           iv.      All in favor and the motion carries.

                                                             v.      Mr. Dodson congratulates firefighter Woehlecke from the board.

                                                           vi.      Chief Cassin stated that in anticipation he has already been run through PERF and passed both mental and physical.  He is ready to go as soon as he delivers the paperwork and gets the signature.

                                                         vii.      Mr. Dodson stated that the department needs to get the next hiring process started.  Chief Cassin replied that the process has been started and the department already has a timeline.

b.      Upcoming project presentations

                                                              i.      2007 Staff Car Realignment Proposal (PowerPoint by Chief Slauter)

1.      Next month the budget process starts.  As a department we have already been working several issues which started during the retreat in January.  A couple of items are going to be introduced and the department can answer any questions.  This is just an introduction of some issues the department has been working on.

2.      A copy of the PowerPoint can be e-mailed upon request.

3.      Main idea is to condense the three battalion vehicles to one large response vehicle. 

4.      Reduces the need for equipment at a reduction of approximately $35,900.

5.      Plan is to trade the current pool and prevention cars along with the highest mileage Battalion vehicle to be replaced in rotation this year for one Battalion vehicle and the Fire Chief vehicle.  The two remaining Battalion vehicles would become the new pool and prevention vehicles.  The staff car replaced would become future staff car for realignment which will be discussed at a later date.

6.      Mr. Dodson asked what the fill would be if the Battalion vehicle were to go down.  To which Chief Slauter replied, the pool car.

7.      Mr. Sutton stated that we are essentially one less vehicle, what are the vehicles that are being traded in.  The Prevention and Pool car.  Chief Cassin stated that it is one less vehicle which will make more sense in the discussion of the budget next month.  One less vehicle along with the $35,900 impact is significant over the 10 year plan.

                                                            ii.      Fire-Based Ambulance Transport Program (PowerPoint by Chief Slauter)

1.      When looking at the donut counties, Johnson County is one of the few that does not have a fire based EMS relying strictly on private ambulance services.

2.      Large uncertainty with Rural Metro Ambulance.  They will be losing the contract with Perry Township which accounts for about 6000 transports RM will be losing in money.

3.      No date for the transfer to Wishard but Perry is saying that it will happen in 2007.

4.      We believe we would provide better patient care.  Currently there is no follow up, the Engine and the Medic show up and the Medic leaves with the transport and that is the end of the contact.

5.      Continuity of care would increase since the medic taking care of the patient at the scene would then go with the patient instead of being handed off.

6.      More control over the crew.  There are some issues with the people that are placed on the Ambulance and the department has no control over that.

7.      At county wide level there is no contingency plan to replace Rural Metro.

8.      Seals were in Whiteland for less than a year and dropped the contract with Greenwood right before they were to begin service.

9.      Brainstorming to see how this would work in White River Township.  The department is looking into the 2007 Fire Grant which is placing an emphasis on EMS transport vehicles this year.

10. The goal is to have two ambulances, one to run and the other to have as a back-up.  The second one would not be run all the time but would be there if it is needed. 

11. The second option is the SAFER Grant that allows the hiring of personnel.  In the beginning the staff is paid for by the grant but over the years they pay a lower percentage.

a.      NFPA 1710 states that ALS ambulances be run with two Paramedics.

b.      Mr. Raker asked if there was an exception if the Engine was ALS.  Chief Slauter looked and did not see one but stated that it is a recommendation not a standard and has been interpreted in different ways.

12. Capt. Hart is currently analyzing the data from Medic 52.  Mutual aid statistics are neck and neck.  They are doing as many runs out of the district as in. 

a.      In March there were 68 transports out of the district.

b.      There were 70 mutual aid for Greenwood, Bargersville, Perry Twp, Morgan and any other place they are sent.

c.      76 were transported out of the area last month.

d.      That shows well over 100 transports in one month.

13. Mr. Sutton asked if the department would charge for the service.  Chief Slauter and Capt. Hart both replied yes.  For example when two of our firefighters were transported to Wishard they charge $1000 a piece.

a.      We are not to the point of deciding what the exact charge would be.  A public service would be a lot cheaper than a private service.  It would easily be half.

14. Mr. Dodson asked what the response time would be for an ALS unit if there were one here.  Capt Hart stated that the response time would be cut in half.  The Engine response times are from 3-4 minutes and the ambulance would be the same.

15. How much time would it be if there was a mutual aid agreement?  How much time would our ambulances be out of the district vs. Rural Metro and where would the mutual aid come from.  When 52 & 91 are occupied RM sends one from who knows where.  In the long run wouldn’t we need two ALS units in the district?  Chief Slauter stated that yes eventually we would need two.  Greenwood is initiating the same process that we are they are just a little farther behind.  Perry and Decatur mutual aid will be there.  In the long run one would not be enough.

a.      Mr. Dodson wanted to know how many paramedics were currently on the department.  Chief Slauter counted approximately 9 shift, 3 office and 6 or more part-time shift.

b.      In five years we would be funding the extra 7 100%.

c.      The need would be for two ambulances in the district with one as a back-up.  We would need an extra to cover time off.

d.      Mr. Raker asked if the department could get some more numbers together by the next meeting for what we could anticipate.  It will be close to a wash and would need to be because there is no mechanism in place to fund more people.

e.      Mr. Dodson asked if information could be forwarded to the rest of the board so they have an idea as to what everyone is thinking.

f.        Mr. Dodson believes having our own ambulances is to our advantage.

g.      Mr. Raker believes we could provide better and cheaper service.

16. Mr. Sutton asked where Bargersville is on this subject to which Chief Slauter stated that they are utilizing Rural Metro.  Capt Hart has spoken to Mike Morris and there is nothing in the works.  They are linked at the hip with RM and their run load is not even close

a.      Capt Hart stated that we had a run load of 1039 last year.  ALS and BLS runs are very close to equal.  This is rare and BLS runs usually out weight ALS runs but Capt. Hart believes that it is a characteristic of the area.

 

           V.      Adjournment

a.      Meeting adjourned at 8:15 by Mr. Dodson.

 

Next meeting will be May 1, 2007 at 7 p.m.